Episode 64: How I Created a Secure Relationship With My Husband

I am so grateful to have a secure relationship with my husband, but it wasn’t always that way. Earlier in our relationship, I was terrified of being left by him, and I built myself an armor of hyper independence and dishonesty. I pretended to be ways I wasn’t to stay safe and “belong” with him. This lack of safety and insecurity in our relationship, I eventually realized, existed because I wasn’t safe with myself, and it wasn’t until I learned to create that safety with me that I could start to create safety in our relationship. When I did learn to become secure in myself, I was able to see more clearly what needed to change in our marriage, and I had the strength to ask for that change. In this episode, I talk about how I learned to create security with myself and how from there, I began creating security in my marriage and all my relationships. For those of you who are, like I was, feeling stuck in a painful relationship, I hope this episode will give you some clues into your own process of creating security in yourself first and in your relationships second. I can’t wait for you to listen, and I’d love to hear your thoughts when you do.

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Transcript

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You are listening to the ex good girl podcast episode 64. Hi, happy Wednesday. I am recording this on Tuesday, April 23rd, which is my 25th wedding anniversary. And I wanted to To expand on a conversation that I actually had with a client, and she was, I had shared something that had happened in my relationship with my husband, a frustration that I had shared with him, something, you know, that Didn't go very well between the two of us. And she said, I thought you had the perfect relationship. And so when I shared that we were, you know, having this thing to work out, she said it, it was reassuring to her because she had had this idea that, you know, perfect relationship. And that because I have been coaching for this long and, and have some, you know, some of the training levels that I have that. I have, you know, this perfect relationship and it was reassuring that I was struggling as well. And I wrote back and I said, Oh, friend, if I have ever given you the impression that I have a perfect relationship, that is absolutely not the case. I think what I have now is a secure relationship where fighting and being bored with each other sometimes are all normal, and they don't mean that anything terrible is wrong. It also means times of incredible connection and deeply felt love. And there is safety the whole time. And that's what I wanted to do a podcast episode about because I think creating a secure relationship is the goal that many of us have. And while it is truly remarkable to me that we have the type of relationship that we have today, based on how our relationship has looked in the past, I deeply believe. That anyone who wants a secure relationship can create one and have one and it starts with creating security and safety within yourself. And so I'm going to share what I have learned about how to create a secure relationship. In the hope that it gives you a little bit of a roadmap, answer some questions. And as always, I welcome your feedback and your questions, which can be sent to my email, Sarah at Sarah Fisk dot coach, or you can find me on Instagram and send me a DM. So as a little background, I've talked a little bit about this in, um, the The episode that I did with my husband, which is in the first like five or six episodes of this podcast. If you're interested, I, we got married, um, really having no idea what, what it was going to take to have a healthy relationship. Like everyone, we were raised in different families with different values. And although we did have a lot in common, including our shared religious faith. Um, That was really about it. Our families were very different. And although I had a lot of just incorrect ideas about what marriage was going to be, I truly believe this is like, you know, marrying my best friend and now we just get to hang out and be in love and complete each other and all that, you know, things that, that sound like nonsense to me today. But I was very confused when We had lots of problems and I did not know what to do with the tension. I did not know how to communicate. And so what I did was I just armored up and I believe that the best way to kind of make it through this is by protecting myself by being fiercely independent, by not needing him, by being able to. you know, do it myself. And that actually worked for a long time. Now, I think it's helpful to know that our shared religious faith was, uh, Mormonism. And inside of Mormonism, there, there really isn't Uh, an approved reason to divorce unless someone does something that is immoral or illegal. And since neither of us were participating in anything, you know, immoral or illegal, we both felt a little stuck, stuck in the relationship, stuck in the decision to be together. And so I thought that the best way to get through that was. Like I said, to just be hyper independent and what that armor was protecting was actually a really, really scared little girl who was terrified that my husband was going to leave me. That it was going to be too much that the fighting and the disagreeing and the lack of compatibility that we discovered after we got married was just going to be too much and was going to break us. And so it was this really weird back and forth, which I'm sure was very confusing for my husband of. On the one hand, like I said, being very armored and very self protective, but on the other hand, also walking on eggshells, trying not to upset him, trying to find the right words to have a conversation, and, um, feeling the anxiety all the time of, He's going to leave. He's going to leave. He's going to leave. And the push and pull of that must have been very confusing for him. I know it was for me. One of the lenses that I use in my coaching is the lens of attachment. I didn't know anything about attachment at that point. At that point, but now looking back, I had a huge anxiety about being left being abandoned. And so I would do things like not want to end a conversation. If we were fighting, he would say something like, I think we need to cool off. I think we need to take some time. And I would interpret that as he's, he's leaving, he's leaving. And so I would. Go after him to try to get him to stay in the fight with me, because at least that didn't get that didn't feel like being left to me. So the very first thing I had to do was deal with that fear of being left by creating safety and security for me by me and with me. And here's exactly what I mean by that. Every time that little, well, it wasn't even a little, it was huge, that huge wave of anxiety, he's going to leave, he's going to leave, he's going to leave. I had to be the adult who would go to that little part of me that was so scared and say, I am with you. I am right here. I am paying attention to you. I'm listening. I will be with you no matter what. Now, as you hear my voice, say those words. Pay attention to what happens in your own body and imagine saying that to yourself. I'm right here with you. I'm listening. You have my full attention. I know that this is hard, but I will be with you no matter what. I will take care of us no matter what. And if you feel A little settling that is the feeling of creating security and safety for yourself. It also means that you have to stop beating yourself up and making yourself the bad person. That's what I had to do. I had to stop going after myself with a bullying vengeance. To tear myself apart for every, every time we had a fight and I didn't choose the right words, and it made it worse, or every time I thought I was doing something nice and he misunderstood it or misread it and it created disconnection, I had start to believe at least a little bit that I am a good person. Who makes mistakes sometimes. I am a good person who sometimes miscalculates. I am a good person who makes the best decisions she is capable of that sometimes don't go the way I want them to go. Instead of looking at myself as a bad person, I had to look at myself as a good person who is wounded. Who has wounds that Dan did not create and that Dan cannot fix. And I had to address those wounds with love. That was a huge, huge shift for me. Because I had been very used to, like many of us are, motivating myself to make a change by beating myself up. If I'm just hard enough on myself, I thought. Then I will change this. That's how I lost weight. That's how I, you know, tried to go about making many of the big changes I wanted in my life was just by being terrible to myself and then using that feeling of shame as fuel. But what we all know, or what I hope you can at least consider is that that doesn't work. It might work in the short term. It might work. For a little while, but it feels terrible so to look at myself, not as a bad person making bad choices, but as a good person who is wounded a good person who makes mistakes really changed the way I was able to show up with me. I say this every single time I get the chance, so I will say it again here. If you beat yourself up, bully yourself, tear yourself down, you are not safe anywhere because you are with you all the time. The reverse is true also. If you can create safety and security with yourself, you can take that safety and security with you wherever you go. And so what I began to believe is. You know, even if Dan does leave me, I've got me, I will take very, very good care of me. And that was when a lot of small changes added up to really big changes. The other thing I had to do with that safety and security created, I had to find and connect with what I really wanted. A lot of women, most of the women that I know have some version of, I don't know who I am, uh, Outside of this relationship or outside of this job that I do, that's very normal. Because again, women are programmed to earn our attention out to serve, to be nice, to be kind, to take responsibility for other people's emotions and situations to rescue. And we're told that that is good mothering. That's being a good wife, being a good daughter, sister, employee, whatever. That if you are concerned about other people first and yourself second, that's being a good girl. The other part of that is if you're always focused on other people, how do you know what you want? How do you know what you really desire? How do you know what you really need? I had to stop pretending that I could do everything all the time. I had to stop pretending that I wasn't tired. I had to stop in many cases, being the person that everybody could count on all the time to do all the things. And I had to learn how to let myself navigate other people's disappointment, including my husband's. So finding what I really wanted. It's an ongoing process. But here's how I did it. I created time where I was able to just be with me and to listen to an inner knowing and inner wisdom that seemed native to me, right? It wasn't anything that someone else gave me. I had it. And to trust that that knowing and that wisdom would direct me. And then I had to believe it. This is probably the place where I'm doing the most work currently. I still go back and forth. Do I really want this? Is this really the best thing? Is it going to work out? And I'm in that probably right along with all of you where I want to make a decision, but I have some doubt. I, I'm pretty sure I know what I want, but I'm not sure. And what that means is that I have to take a step in that direction, trusting that it will work out. Let me give you an example. The last couple of weeks I have been launching the next group coaching program, stop people pleasing that I do four times a year. This launch felt terrible. It felt like I wasn't prepared. I was dragging myself through doing all of the work. I knew that I didn't want to be doing it, but I felt a lot of obligation, a lot of duty and a lot of like, if I give up, I'm, I'm weak. So you can hear all of that programming that might feel very familiar to you. I decided to cancel the launch. That's why there was no episode. Last week, right? Or two weeks ago. I canceled everything. And I still, I went probably about four to six hours of just, should I, should I, should I, do I, do I, do I, what can I do, what can, what's going to happen, what are the pros, cons. And then finally I made the decision with a very small hunch that it was the right thing to do. Canceled everything, decided to just take a step in that direction, not knowing for sure that it was right. And then 24 hours later. I knew it was absolutely the right thing to do. So if you are in this discovery of what you want, it will always involve taking a step into the unknown of, I think I want this, but I'm not sure to test it. You have to be willing to go in the direction of what you might want or you think you desire to confirm whether or not that's the case. And that's exactly why you have to have your back. You can't beat yourself up. Because let's say that I had cancelled the launch and then felt terrible about it and there was some information that made me think it was the wrong decision, I would have to be very kind with myself. And believe that I'm a good person. And sometimes I make mistakes. I'm a good person. And sometimes I miscalculate. That's why the work of stopping the bullying has to happen first. So that when you are excavating what you really want and desire from all of those layers of good girl programming, you are so gentle and tender with yourself. There is going to be An element of, um, of unknown to this because our programming is so deep that other people tell us what we want. Other people tell us what is important for us to be doing. We don't know. Right. So much self doubt is just baked into the experience of being a female socialized as a female. I should say that that's just going to be there. There are also going to be places where you are going to have to stop pretending because the pretending that you have done in your relationships is to get a reward of people thinking that you're fantastic, thinking that you are the strong one thinking. I mean, this is how it exactly was for me. I loved being the person that everybody could count on. I loved. Hearing how capable and how strong everyone thought I was, and that's exactly what I had to give up because I was spending so much time pretending, especially for my husband, pretending I didn't need him, pretending I wasn't tired, pretending I could do it on my own, pretending that, um, I was, I was fine to be armored up and separate. And I had to learn how to stop that. Pretending. I also had to learn to stop pretending and performing to get love and security from other people. I had to really, really believe that no matter what happened in any of my relationships. That I would take really, really good care of myself, no matter what. This is a tricky one, and it's tricky because all of our human mammal programming is to belong. To find safety, to find connection, to find community and belonging, because that's what we need for survival. But when you are in a relationship where that love and safety that you get comes from pretending and performing, there's always an element of insecurity to it, because even if it's not conscious, you know, on some level, if I stop doing this, if I stop the pretending and performing, are they going to love me? Are they going to want to connect to me and so many of the actions that I was taking, especially in my marriage were to get love and security that the anxiousness I felt underneath is. What'll happen if I stop? So it is essential that we learn to navigate the discomfort that comes from disappointing other people so that they can get to know the real us. My real desires, my real fears, my real emotions, my real needs. Because when you're pretending and performing, they are in a relationship with a fake version of you to some degree. They are in a relationship with a performance. And not really you, I had to learn to tell the truth. That's an essential part of stopping the pretending and performing. I had to learn to tell the truth about what was really going on for me. And so that means I had to know what was really going on for me. I had to slow down and check in with myself. And I had to learn to communicate in a way that didn't favor niceness. over clarity. So much of the time, I was just trying to find the right words. And I was trying to be overly nice, overly kind. And so the clarity just didn't exist. I had to learn to be direct in asking for what I wanted and needed. And that meant tolerating a lot of discomfort. I had to learn to take accountability for the communication patterns that were based in my insecurity, right? I had to accept that even though something wasn't necessarily my fault, it was my fault. It was my opportunity and my responsibility because no one else could change it. I had to take responsibility for my part in the experience that I was creating. I had to admit I didn't have the communication skills that I needed. I didn't know how to communicate with kindness and clarity at the same time. And I had to learn those skills. And then one of the more difficult parts of creating the security in my relationship was I had to grapple with, and in a large part just get over, What felt really unfair at the time, which was me having to make changes first, the unfairness of having to be the first one to change some unhealthy dynamics within myself, the first one to try to communicate differently, the first one to try to, you know, regulate myself. In a fight, my, my insecurity really wanted Dan to go first so that I knew that my efforts wouldn't be wasted. I wanted some kind of guarantee. Like, if I'm going to do this, if I'm going to become, you know, uh, a person who can communicate clearly, for example, I want to know that you're going to listen to what I have to say. I want to know that you're going to take me seriously. I want to know that when I talk, you're actually going to slow down and pay attention. And as much. As it's nice to have some security about the outcome, sometimes you just don't have it. And in a lot of cases, I didn't feel like I had it. And even though I wanted him to go first, I also knew that someone had to go first. And that's how it is. Sometimes it's just not possible for both of you to be working on changes at the same time or for you to require that your partner goes first. And so someone has to and grappling with dealing with the unfairness that that sometimes feel like feels like actually ends up being a critical part of the process. And that's how it is. Getting some important data back from the other person, because if I hadn't been willing to go 1st, in some cases, and I didn't I didn't always go 1st. I actually want to be very clear about that. Dan made lots and lots of efforts, but I think it was in response. To some of the efforts he saw me making. And so as I made efforts and he reciprocated those efforts, now we got some data back about each other. Like, okay, we do care about this. We do want a better, more secure, connected, loving, vulnerable relationship. And what I stayed stuck in the unfairness of having to go first. Then we wouldn't have had that data and feedback about each other. And so even though there is, I think, a very normal feeling of sometimes unfairness about going first, making changes and making things better, it actually gives you some really important data about the other person's capacity or willingness to meet you in creating a new relationship dynamic. And that was a huge. Factor in, in creating security together. Like I knew that I could create security for myself and safety for myself. And then coming back to my relationship, going first, making some changes and seeing him reciprocate was a huge factor in the secure relationship dynamic that we have now, I also had to learn to tolerate talking about my fears. The fear that he would leave me, I had to learn to tolerate the discomfort of my vulnerability, saying to him, I need you and I'm so afraid that you will leave me all of the tolerating of my own discomfort was really. Only possible because I would never beat myself up if I did something and later decided it wasn't the right thing to do or it wasn't how I wished I would have said it, but it was also facilitated by the relationship that we now have of reciprocating and both of us making changes to the relationship dynamic, both of us trying this last part that I am still working on. is learning how to say things that feel like really vulnerable to me. How much I love him, how much I need him, how much I fear not him leaving me now, but um, losing him. And You'll hear some emotion in my voice because I still, I feel these things very deeply. And as I have learned to tolerate just the sheer discomfort of being so vulnerable and, and open to him, it doesn't feel any more like fear. It doesn't feel like terror. It doesn't feel, um, like it once did. It just now feels like I'm being really. open and vulnerable, but I can better tolerate the discomfort of that. Lastly, and this is the most counterintuitive part, which is why I'm kind of saving it for last. I had to realize that my insecure attachment and what I thought was going to fix it, I was, I was a little mistaken because I kept wanting my husband or my friends to act differently so that I would feel more secure. I kept wanting my husband to say different words or behave differently when we were together. Disconnected. And while all of that is fine, the very first component of a secure attachment is me attached to me, me taking care of me, me looking out for my sadness, my grief, my worry, my anxiety, my fear, my anxiousness, and me showing up for me. So here's exactly what that looks like. Every single time I would imagine or excuse me, not even imagine every single time I would be in a disconnected state. The insecure version of Sarah would chase after, uh, my husband and either like, try to fight and engage with him, try to keep him in the conversation or distract, right? Trying to distract myself, pretend like I didn't need him, pretend like it wasn't a big deal. Pretend like I could totally handle it myself. And so I would either like chase and try and engage or ignore and distract. And I had to realize that the third option there was me sitting down with me, putting my hands on my chest or my forehead or my cheeks or the back of my neck and my chest, which is one of my favorite positions and saying, I know that this is hard. I know that this disconnection hurts so much, but I'm right here with you. And what I mean by that is I had to call on a self. I do a lot of parts work with my clients. And so in internal family systems, which is where this idea of parts work comes from, or is, or is organized into like a therapeutic model, the self is compassionate, curious, can be clear. These are the C's of the self, creative, courageous, connected, calm, confident. I like adding presence and open heartedness. I had to call on that part of me to be with the part of me that was scared, that was worried, that was fearful, that was anxious, that was sure that this time was going to end in divorce. Like this time I'd really done it right. And so I had to call on my adult, knowledgeable, resourced, calm, compassionate part to be with the other part that was scared. And I had to have, I had to allow conversations between the two. I had to say, I know this is hard. I know you don't like this at all. I know. This feels terrible, but I'm right here with you. You don't have to be alone. And that is how we feel those insecure parts of us first with our own presence. That's how we create like a stable landing pad. Every time there's disconnection, the landing pad is me, me with me, me taking care of me, me seeing out and after me. I would imagine that. The part of myself that was scared and alone was in a bedroom somewhere, afraid, all by herself, and that the adult, resourced, calm, compassionate me could go find her. Could sit with her could put my arm around her if she needed and wanted that could come for her and could tell her I am here with you. I will never leave you. And you can hear how emotional this makes me because it's so powerful and that. Is the essential component, because when you are in securely attached, what we don't realize is the only foundational connection that we are 100 percent in charge of is us with us, me with me, that's the only connection that I am 100 percent in control of everyone else's connection with me. It's, it's not entirely in my hands. And so the foundational connection is me with me, and once I began to nurture that not to let any of those sad, scared, angry, raging, and you know, parts of me be alone, I could go to them, and once they were not alone. They could calm and they could heal. And what that means is today I can experience disconnection with people and it doesn't mean that it isn't painful and that it doesn't get my attention. But what it means is that I can be with myself and say, I know this is really hard right now. But we're gonna be able to figure this out. We're going to be able to find a solution here. We're going to be able to find the words to talk about it. We're going to be able to do the work to connect again and. I can say things to my husband that in the past I could never say, for example, like, I need you so much. I hate being disconnected like this and we need to work out this other issue that we're having. Let's let's say that we're having issues about. You know, sharing the workload in the home. I used to give in and just do it because I was so afraid of the disconnection or the disconnection would happen. It would be a huge fight. I would be anxious and stressed for, you know, hours and hours and hours. And then we would repair, but never actually solve the problem. So now, because of the work that I have done to have a secure attachment to myself. We can experience disconnection and I can say, this doesn't feel good. I really wish we could be connected. I really don't want to do it this way. And it is not okay with me that I am the one doing X and X and X and X. And I need some, um, I need some buy in. I need some partnership from you on this. So I hope that some of the things I have shared give you a road map to creating a secure relationship for yourself. Because I truly, truly, truly believe that if we can do it, anyone can do it. Unless, let me just, Say the caveat that I think should be obvious, but maybe it's not unless there is something abusive going on, unless there is someone with a mental illness or, um, some other, um, mental, um, incapacity or, or underdevelopment, and I'm not talking about, you know, ADHD or autism. I'm talking about an actual diagnosis of mental illness. ADHD and autism are neurodivergence. That's completely different. But. In the absence of diagnosable mental illness or abuse, I really believe that if it's something you want to do, you can. If you don't want to do it, you shouldn't have to, right? This is, this is a choice. And so I know that there are people who listen to this podcast that are in relationships where you still bump into each other's sore spots, tender spots, and you wonder if it's worth it. You want it to be worth it because you deeply love the other person. And I hope that this episode has given you a little bit of a roadmap, some clues to, to look for in yourself, some things to start. Considering putting some effort into, because what I will say is that the sweetness of the relationship that I have now with myself first, and with my husband and loved ones, friends. Second, it's so worth it. It's worth all of the learning to tolerate discomfort, all of the learning to change what I could change about the dynamic. It was worth all the times that I went first. I don't even remember now who went first or second in most of the changes that we made because it just has all added up. To a really beautiful experience that I want everyone to be able to experience, whether it's in you, you can have it for sure in your relationship with yourself. And then you can take that beautiful, secure relationship you have with yourself. And that becomes the measuring stick for your other relationships. As I think it should be. If this episode has been helpful for you, I will tell you it is the thing that has foundationally changed me and my relationship with my husband. It is the work that I do with, uh, in private client work and in group work. So if you are interested in learning about that with me, it's time to grab that consult link from my Instagram bio and sign up to have a conversation with me.